From Conan to Stern, SiriusXM CEO Jennifer Witz is betting on expertise and distribution

Jennifer Witz is the CEO of SiriusXM, a quietly fascinating firm. You in all probability comprehend it because the satellite tv for pc radio model that’s in just about each new automotive, but it surely additionally owns Pandora, an enormous podcast community that features 99% Invisible and Workforce Coco, and a content material operation that helps big stars like Howard Stern and has offers with each main sports activities league. 

What’s significantly fascinating about SiriusXM is that it began as a distribution play — truly, two distribution performs. Sirius and XM have been two completely different corporations. They each launched competing satellite tv for pc radio companies within the early 2000s, mainly pre-internet, and ultimately merged.

Sirius is successfully the dominant market chief for built-in premium audio in automobiles. On the identical time, the competitors is right here. Spotify exists, podcasts exist, and sure, the SiriusXM app exists as properly. And because the infotainment system in automobiles will get ever extra advanced and computer-like, the Sirius expertise has to maintain up. A thesis of Decoder is that distribution impacts what sort of content material you make, so I needed to know the way Jennifer is considering all of these completely different sorts of distribution. What are the variations between what Sirius makes for podcasts, for Pandora, and for the satellite tv for pc system? 

On high of that, the state of automotive software program is in whole flux. GM simply introduced it gained’t assist CarPlay in new EVs. A lot of corporations are utilizing numerous riffs on Android. One thing referred to as QNX retains effervescent alongside. Tesla has its personal factor. It’s a multitude. And Sirius has to assist all of it with purposes that compete with Large Tech corporations, all whereas persevering with to combine the satellite tv for pc {hardware} into the automobiles themselves — on high of placing satellites on SpaceX rockets.

That’s quite a bit for Jennifer to handle, and we coated numerous floor. I additionally assume I received Jennifer to agree to maneuver Street Journey Radio to the Sirius channels, so for many who know, that’s a win.  

Okay, Jennifer Witz, CEO of SiriusXM. Right here we go.

This transcript has been flippantly edited for readability.

Jennifer Witz, you’re the CEO of SiriusXM. Welcome to Decoder.

Thanks, Nilay. It’s nice to be right here.

I’m very excited to have you ever right here. I’m a Sirius buyer, so I simply have quite a lot of function requests. That’s it. That’s what we’re doing for the total hour. My spouse is a hardcore person of the app; she has quite a lot of function requests, so prepare.

Nice, I’d love to listen to them.

Let’s begin on the very starting. One of many themes we speak about in Decoder on a regular basis is that your distribution typically impacts what you make, and we see this over and over and over. I’ve defined it 1,000,000 instances. YouTube is my favourite instance. Everyone knows what a YouTuber seems like. Sirius is a very fascinating firm as a result of it has so many various sorts of distribution, that are sort of the product. It began as two completely different satellite tv for pc corporations with competing concepts about distribution. You’ve Pandora, which is an web radio firm. You’ve Stitcher, which is a podcasting guess throughout every kind of different individuals’s distributions. How do you concentrate on that?

Take heed to Decoder, a present hosted by The Verge’s Nilay Patel about massive concepts — and different issues. Subscribe right here!

It actually begins with Sirius and XM, which got here collectively about 14–15 years in the past now. That’s the main supply of our income. Subscription income from SiriusXM represents about 70 p.c of our general income, so we’re actually centered on how we will proceed to ship worth to our SiriusXM subscribers. And the majority of these subscribers are listening to us over satellite tv for pc within the automotive but it surely actually restricted our capacity to do sure varieties of distribution.

So the content material that we offer over satellite tv for pc is basically broadcast, proper? One to many. The pipe is simply so massive; you’ll be able to solely put so many channels on the air. However more and more, with our new platform that’s rolling out, which we name 360L, we will have much more interactivity in our service, whether or not it’s simply suggestions or extra content material generally however as you talked about, we’ve a lot broader distribution. When you begin on the broadest level, it’s what we’re doing with podcasting, and that’s we imagine in podcasters and content material creators who wish to distribute their content material broadly throughout all third-party platforms. And so we’ve actually sturdy enterprise there as properly, and that helps feed into SiriusXM over time.

I wish to begin with the satellite tv for pc enterprise. Like I mentioned, I’m a buyer, so I’ve a brand-new automotive that has 360L in it, and you’ll’t inform the distinction between when it’s utilizing cellular broadband and when it’s utilizing the satellite tv for pc service. Then, I’ve a automotive from 2016, which truly solely has a Sirius radio. It doesn’t have an XM radio. And this, to me, is likely one of the most fascinating expertise dilemmas that perhaps any CEO has to face. Sirius launched in 2002, XM in 2001. I bear in mind the XM launch and that the primary two satellites have been named Rock and Roll. That’s caught in my reminiscence. You must launch satellites to assist this enterprise, and the satellites should not suitable with one another. You may’t improve the present base of {hardware} within the automobiles. How do you concentrate on that satellite tv for pc enterprise? How many individuals work on the satellites?

It’s nonetheless the core of our enterprise. We’re launching 4 extra satellites over the subsequent few years, and we’ve a constellation of satellites as we speak that feed Sirius and XM, and really, the satellites are designed now to deal with both community, so that they’re interchangeable, which offers us with numerous redundancy in orbit. There was simply information as we speak that automobiles are more and more on the highway for for much longer intervals of time. So we’ve an put in base of automobiles on the market, 150 million or extra, and lots of of them have solely entry to Sirius or solely entry to XM, which we check with as low band and excessive band, respectively, however each of them get the identical set of content material as we speak. That’s one of many issues that we carried out shortly after the merger. 

Wait, right here’s my first function request. My 2016 with solely a Sirius radio, it might’t get Street Journey Radio as a result of it’s within the excessive band.

Proper. When you look on Reddit, this can be a frequent criticism about this one highly regarded station.

Very fashionable station, particularly this time of yr. I’ll take that again to the group and see what we will do.

All proper. Outcomes on Decoder. However that is the guts of the issue, proper?

You’re closely hardware-dependent in an more and more software program world, and I’m simply questioning how you concentrate on that exact sort of downside.

We have now two avenues, I believe, to deal with it. More and more, we’re rolling out our 360L platform, and that permits for a limiteless quantity of content material. It’s rolling out slowly. A couple of third of our new automotive trial begins are 360L-capable as we speak, however that’s solely about 8 million automobiles on the highway. So 8 of the 150 million. The opposite mechanism we’ve to deal with is, in fact, streaming solely. And we’re slowly constructing our streaming-only subscriber base. The overwhelming majority of our subscribers as we speak are centered on listening within the automotive with the radio that’s embedded within the automotive, however streaming permits us to leverage in automobiles that will not have a satellite tv for pc radio and even in automobiles that do however perhaps as a second listening level in a automobile you simply wish to stream, so you’ll be able to take heed to the app by means of CarPlay, Android Auto, and more and more, we’ll have higher options there as properly.

You simply made some hires to enhance that app and to enhance the form of on-line supply of the content material, proper? Clarify what’s happening there.

So final yr, in January, we introduced Joe Inzerillo on board as our head of product and expertise. He got here from Disney. He was very concerned within the launch of Disney Plus, and as a part of BAMTech, he was concerned in numerous different D2C video launches as properly. He has constructed out a group on the firm centered on our launch of our next-generation SiriusXM platform. It’ll begin later this yr with new streaming apps as a result of, as we’ve talked about, the corporate began as satellite tv for pc radio with no actual digital connection to the patron. So we’ve used numerous conventional advertising strategies to succeed in customers, and going ahead, we wish to be sure that we will use all the infrastructure that he’s constructing throughout commerce and identification, MarTech, and higher information to offer higher experiences for purchasers throughout all their touchpoints, whether or not it’s by means of advertising, within the product, in fact, or customer support or anyplace else.

I wish to come again to that as a result of that sounds actually fascinating. When you simply take into consideration Sirius advertising as we speak, you purchase a automotive and also you get mail till you give in and join, or the automotive is continually exhibiting you a preview. And also you’re saying you’re going to construct another equipment, which I wish to speak about. However simply at a very primary stage, you will have a brand new group that’s going to construct a brand new on-line platform. They’re in a position to go and tackle a bunch of what at the moment are primarily commodity companies.

You employed anyone from BAMTech. They will return to BAMTech and say, “We wish to purchase your platform and use it for streaming audio as a substitute of video.” Or there’s 1,000,000 different suppliers like AWS. On the satellite tv for pc facet, you described it as a proprietary platform, so there’s in all probability not the big ecosystem of distributors and suppliers to say, “We’re going to construct you a satellite tv for pc radio service.” How is that value break up up in your head? As you concentrate on working the corporate, do you need to make use of numerous proprietary satellite tv for pc radio frequency engineers?

We do, and once more, it’s a very core a part of our enterprise — ensuring that we’ve engineers and specialists on every little thing from the published operations facet by means of to satellite tv for pc supply, uplink, designing the satellites, working with Maxar as our third get together that’s setting up the satellites, and SpaceX will launch them. However we’re actually concerned within the design of every little thing: the radios, the receivers, the chipsets, and dealing with third events by means of that. And we’ve the identical sort of challenges and alternatives everybody else has there: how can we be sure that we’ve a number of sources and we will proceed to execute on that technique? So we do have numerous distinctive expertise within the firm to make the most of that very proprietary pipe.

And one of many nice issues about satellite tv for pc supply or broadcast, if you’ll, is as soon as the satellites are within the air, clearly we’ve the fee to keep up them, but it surely’s largely then a sunk value. We don’t have any variable prices for supply. And on the streaming facet of the enterprise, as we construct that platform and it’s a complement within the automotive for supply for 360L, we could have extra variable prices in the fee construction. However sure, there’s a set of frequent, at the least underlying, ideas within the structure that we’ll be capable to leverage as we construct that.

So let me simply decode that. You’re saying you spent a bunch of cash up entrance on the satellite tv for pc; you set it within the sky. That value is value, and it might service nevertheless many purchasers. And that’s positive.

And also you go to the cloud, to broadband, and as you add clients, each buyer is a cloud charge or a broadband charge or another set of prices that come together with each new buyer?

As you’re employed in your projections and also you say, “An increasing number of, we’re going to go to broadband.” Is that one thing you’re factoring in?

Look, we’ve actually sturdy margins on the SiriusXM facet of the enterprise. Partly, that’s due to our licensing construction, however given our pricing and our excessive variable margins, it simply offers us numerous alternative to have the ability to leverage completely different supply mechanisms however nonetheless, on a marginal foundation, be certain that our subscriber economics are very favorable.

Let me ask you the Decoder questions now as a result of I believe we’re proper within the coronary heart of it. How is the corporate structured? How have you ever organized SiriusXM?

We’re functionally structured, so my group of direct stories is made up of 4 people that I’d say run nearly all of the enterprise facet of the corporate. We talked about Joe Inzerillo, who’s our head of product and expertise. I’ve Scott Greenstein, who’s head of content material. After which I’ve two people who find themselves extra centered on the business facet of the group: our chief business officer, Joe Verbrugge, who’s chargeable for engagement and onboarding of all subscribers or listeners throughout our companies, and he has all subscription income as properly; after which John Trimble, who runs all of our advert gross sales. They make up the enterprise facet of the group, after which I’ve 4 people on my group who’re chargeable for extra of the company features. Barbara Daniel runs our technique group; after which, in fact, our CFO Tom Barry; our head of individuals and tradition, Faye Tylee; after which our basic counsel, Pat Donnelly. After which I’ve a chief of workers who’s unbelievable in serving to me coordinate the group.

A purposeful construction right here is sort of fascinating since you do have these massive teams that folks can see — consumer-facing manufacturers—– the radios and the automobiles but in addition Pandora and Stitcher and a bunch of well-known podcast manufacturers like Workforce Coco. Do you run all of them centrally? Do you say, “Okay, right here’s the Stitcher technique, and right here’s the automotive radio technique, and that each one rolls as much as me, and I’m setting a technique throughout them”? Since you would assume that these could be extra unbiased than not.

“On the finish of the day, it’s about bringing content material to listeners.”

The most effective factor is that if we will have the purposeful leaders present their experience throughout these companies. They’re not that various within the sense that we’re delivering audio content material to listeners. On the finish of the day, it’s about bringing content material to listeners. I need our head of content material, Scott Greenstein, to be centered on one of the simplest ways to try this throughout all of the platforms, after which our head of product and tech to be centered on one of the simplest ways to ship that content material throughout all of the platforms. I actually imagine in leveraging the experience throughout these purposeful leaders, after which we work as a group, in fact, to drive selections which are going to enhance the enterprise throughout these completely different particular person manufacturers.

One factor I’ve realized over the previous decade or so being a tech journalist is issues that abstractly appear the identical once you have a look at them on the web are very completely different from a enterprise perspective. When corporations say, “We’re simply going to make use of the web to ship audio the identical means we delivered audio utilizing FM or satellite tv for pc,” my listeners are all the time like, “That’s simply the identical. What’s the distinction between a podcast and a radio present?” That is the place I get to that thesis that the distribution truly has big impacts in each instructions, and the enterprise of podcasting is means much less profitable than the enterprise of FM radio. We simply had Conal Byrne from iHeartMedia on the present, and he mentioned FM radio is the place the cash is at, and he’s utilizing the podcasts to assist market that stuff. What’s your most profitable enterprise? Is it nonetheless the satellite tv for pc service?

Undoubtedly. The SiriusXM facet is the core a part of the enterprise, and I really feel actually good about the place we’re with that enterprise as a result of we’ve a extremely worthwhile core enterprise the place our subscriber base could be very loyal. We run an annual buyer satisfaction survey. We’ve had the best CSAT [customer satisfaction] rating we’ve seen since we began working it over a decade in the past, and that’s led to essentially low churn. On condition that we’ve excessive variable margins, that flows by means of general to increased EBITDA margins. And we’re one of the vital worthwhile media corporations on the market. That simply provides us numerous latitude to evolve the enterprise going ahead.

And I like our place within the promoting facet of the enterprise as properly as a result of Pandora actually began digital audio promoting all these years in the past, and we’ve an awesome, succesful group there. Numerous advert tech with AdsWizz, which Pandora purchased earlier than we acquired Pandora, and we’ve been in a position to leverage that experience, whether or not it’s the gross sales pressure or the expertise, to have a much bigger stake within the podcast enterprise as properly.

When you concentrate on that construction and decision-making, do you ever think about transferring a present from the podcast distribution community the place the charges is perhaps decrease to the satellite tv for pc distribution community the place you will have actually excessive margins?

We take into consideration that on a regular basis. We have now numerous completely different fashions on the market, and I’m unsure we’ve discovered the best one. There’s no constant mannequin throughout the board that we level to. A part of it ties again to what the creator or the expertise needs. And there’s this stability. Numerous definitely discuss or nonmusic content material creators need broad-based distribution. It ties into relevance and viewers development, and we’re pleased to assist that. We have now numerous advert illustration offers with expertise like Ashley Flowers at Crime Junkie and her community at Audiochuck, the place she needs broad distribution. So it makes numerous sense.

The place we’ve modified the mannequin over time is one thing such as you mentioned with Workforce Coco, the place we truly purchased the corporate from Conan O’Brien, and he’s stayed very near producing his highly regarded podcast, Conan [O’Brien] Wants a Good friend, which is broadly distributed, however we even have extra unique content material on SiriusXM. We have now a linear radio channel that has parts from the podcast but in addition broader parts, and he’s created new content material for that channel.

Over time, the targets are to proceed to assist the promoting facet of our enterprise and develop that, and there’s definitely been numerous tailwinds in podcasting there, but in addition discover methods to serve the core SiriusXM enterprise by bringing extra unique content material to that platform.

I wish to get into that, particularly the podcasting tailwinds as a result of that appears to be only a convulsion that the whole audio business went by means of, and perhaps now we’re getting by means of the hangover. However first, extra Decoder questions. You’re a part of Liberty Media, a bigger holding firm that famously now owns Formulation One. One Netflix present turned Liberty Media into the F1 firm. Very sensible. How does that work with Sirius? How do you combine with that bigger holding firm?

[Liberty Media president and CEO] Greg Maffei is chairman of the SiriusXM board, and since they got here on in 2009, we’ve had a very sturdy relationship with Liberty Media throughout the board. Actually happy to have them concerned within the enterprise.

One of many issues that stands out about Sirius’ programming generally is the entry to sports activities leagues. Each NFL recreation, each NBA recreation. Do you get preferential therapy from F1 since you’re a part of the household?

We do numerous work with F1 and the opposite companies throughout the Liberty portfolio, however I wouldn’t say there’s any preferential therapy there. We simply launched the Miami Studios, and we did some issues collectively in Miami as a result of it was proper forward of the F1 race there, and I believe there’ll be extra methods for us to collaborate. We work carefully with Reside Nation on quite a lot of issues. However no, I don’t assume there’s any preferential therapy essentially.

You must work out the right way to launch satellites and convey the fee down, make investments, go rent individuals from BAMTech and Disney and construct an app platform, argue throughout the household dinner desk about F1 rights. How do you make selections? What’s your framework?

I’m a giant believer, as a result of I’ve this group of purposeful specialists, in bringing them collectively and listening to their particular person opinions once we’re confronted with a giant resolution. And I like the controversy. We’ve all the time had a historical past, at Sirius, of sort of lively debate on a subject. After which I’m hopeful that we’ll come to at least one path on our personal. However clearly, if not, then I’m the decision-maker, and I actually anticipate the group to leap on board with no matter resolution we’ve made. I’m additionally a giant fan of taking the contrarian view on one thing. So if we’re a call, as an illustration, simply to speculate on this new platform, what occurs if we don’t? And generally, the choice turns into fairly clear once you stack it up that means.

My private favourite mannequin is to simply all the time have the worst concepts within the room. It’s surprisingly enjoyable.

Stroll me by means of a second the place you needed to be the decision-maker.

In all probability in a few of our content material selections as a result of the problem is resolution rights on the finish of the day. If we’re going to launch new content material, I anticipate our head of content material, Scott Greenstein, to return with that proposal and convey it ahead and clarify why it could make sense, however there are going to be opinions from others as a result of the business group must execute on it and be sure that we’re getting the worth from that new content material. Or perhaps, if it’s an promoting deal, we’d like the pinnacle of advert gross sales to be on board. However on the finish of the day, these issues is probably not very clear throughout the group. So, in content material selections, I normally take a fairly lively position.

One of many massive themes together with your content material selections over, I’d say, the previous yr or so, is a very heavy emphasis on superstar. You’re getting extra well-known names making podcasts. You acquired Stitcher and Earwolf. These have been a little bit extra indie, a little bit extra crunchy. There’s a fairly noticeable shift. You’re saying you’re accountable for content material selections. Stroll me by means of that shift.

Howard Stern received the liberty he needed to form his present on Sirius

A few of it’s as a result of the evolution of the place we’re with podcasting — that there’s much more content material on the market, and there’s much more consideration round podcasting. It’s been an awesome funnel for brand new content material for the enterprise. When you return to the early phases of our launch at Sirius, we introduced Howard Stern onto the platform, and Howard had a large platform by means of his core base within the New York Metropolis space, however then he was syndicated extra broadly. It was time. He made the choice he needed to return to Sirius, and that created a very completely different trajectory for the enterprise. It was actually important that Howard felt it was the best time for him and that he received the form of freedom that he needed to form the present in the best way that he needed on Sirius.

That underlies numerous the choices we make. Creating the content material pipeline that we’ve developed in podcasting has given us publicity to much more expertise, and that goes again to the mannequin that we talked about beforehand of discovering expertise that we will carry behind the paywall to carry much more worth to our subscribers.

I didn’t anticipate a content material moderation query on this interview, however you walked into it. With AM and FM, there’s the FCC. There’s an entire authorized regime about spectrum shortage, and that’s why the federal government could make guidelines. I don’t know the way that performs with the satellite tv for pc stuff, however I believe it’s a lot much less. And with the web, all bets are off. The federal government can’t make any speech rules. What are the restrictions in podcast content material that you just’re speaking about?

I truly don’t assume there are that many restrictions. I believe it’s all concerning the enterprise mannequin and ensuring that there’s sufficient brand-safe content material that advertisers wish to take part in. So I truly assume there’s numerous freedom in podcasting that appears extra much like what we’ve at SiriusXM. At SiriusXM, we would like a broad set of voices. We’re a platform for primarily opinions. We have now the information networks on our service and political viewpoints throughout the spectrum, and we’re actually happy with the range that we’ve been in a position to carry to our platform.

So that you’re saying it’s the market that’s offering no matter restrictions on content material? It’s what advertisers wish to purchase or what integrations, and that is perhaps completely different on the satellite tv for pc service than the digital distributed podcast service?

Again within the day, when Sirius signed Howard Stern, you simply employed a well-known man, he introduced a present over, he was costly, however that’s only a expertise deal. These days, you’ve been shopping for corporations. You spent $150 million on Conan’s podcast firm. You spend a bunch of cash on Crime Junkie, and you’ve got an advert cope with Crooked Media that’s value a bunch of cash. You’ve 99% Invisible, Stitcher, Earwolf. You’re shopping for corporations. Are you seeing the identical return from shopping for these corporations as from hiring a splashy superstar to host one present?

“We purchased Conan’s enterprise, we purchased Stitcher, we purchased 99% Invisible … I believe the big property have largely traded.”

Sure, we purchased Conan’s enterprise, we purchased Stitcher, we purchased 99% Invisible. The opposite offers you’re referencing are actually advert illustration offers, so we haven’t bought the underlying IP. And the place we’ve made the funding in corporations and shopping for the underlying IP, we imagine there’s actual entry to expertise that is sensible for our platform and the economics work. On the advert illustration facet of the enterprise, conventional podcast offers are mainly advert share with a type of minimal assure, and we thought these have been essential to our advert gross sales enterprise as a result of we’re closely invested in Pandora with the recognized working platform, however we needed to take part within the development on the podcasting facet and leverage all these capabilities that we talked about earlier.

Do you assume these offers are figuring out? It appears like there was an actual land rush to signal these sorts of offers. Disclosure: Vox Media has a podcasting community, they do it, too. Spotify spent a bunch of cash, you spent a bunch of cash, everybody else spent a bunch of cash. Did it work out? It looks like that interval has actually cooled off.

When you have a look at our first quarter numbers, podcasting advert income is down about 2 p.c, however podcasting was up 34 p.c. So there’s nonetheless a tailwind on advert gross sales in podcasting. I’m actually happy with the set of content material that we’ve on the advert illustration facet. Relating to the offers, it was positively very aggressive over the previous few years. I believe the big property have largely traded. And I believe there’s a longtime set of distributors on the market within the advert rep enterprise who actually love our content material slate. We have now 5 of the highest 15 podcasts. We have now a broad illustration throughout comedy, true crime, and information, so we’re properly positioned to make the most of what I imagine are continued tailwinds in podcasting — not solely from a listener development standpoint however from an advertiser standpoint as a result of many manufacturers are nonetheless sitting on the sidelines. It’s a small portion of their finances, however we actually have seen, as an illustration, programmatic develop fairly properly over the past a number of months, particularly as advertisers’ budgets liberate on the final minute. They will are available and purchase throughout our podcast community, whether or not they wish to purchase inside a selected present or they wish to purchase throughout an viewers that may cowl all of our podcasts.

You talked about the AdsWizz acquisition earlier. You’ve received some expertise the place you’ll be able to attempt to goal listeners. That is the problem in podcasting: determining the right way to get the best advertisements in entrance of the best individuals. And then you definately’ve received individuals like me who’re cranky about host reads. Apologies to our podcast advertisements group. These are very private. You may’t goal these. You may’t simply self-service purchase them. You’ve received to go discover expertise. They’ve received to really learn it. The platforms are standing proper there to disintermediate you. You may simply go purchase the advertisements programmatically on Spotify, versus coming to Sirius, or you’ll be able to go purchase the advertisements programmatically on YouTube, or go to the podcast host instantly. How do you sit within the center and say, “It’s best to truly purchase the advertisements from us in podcasting?”

Positive, you’ll find different programmatic options, however I believe the direct gross sales part is basically necessary nonetheless. When you have a look at anyone like Conan, who loves doing host-read advertisements, truly. Possibly it’s best to spend a while listening to his.

There’s an actual distinction between being an entertainer and a journalist, but it surely’s all proper.

They’re unbelievable. He has an entire podcast episode on advertisements that he’s carried out, and he does it for the manufacturers that he actually believes in. We’ve had numerous success with massive manufacturers on his podcast. I believe it actually is dependent upon what the advertiser needs and if they need these customized integrations or they need publicity to reside occasions. Numerous podcasters are doing an increasing number of reside occasions. We are able to carry that set of capabilities, along with programmatics. So it’s a few bigger purchase.

However is that extra bespoke? “You’re going to spend more cash, however you’re going to get Conan O’Brien studying the advertisements for you. You’re going to spend more cash with us, and we’re going to ensure our hosts learn throughout the community.” Or is it, “You’re going to spend more cash with us, and we are going to effectively attain extra viewers,” which is what the platforms would say? 

Sure, and “you’ll be able to attain extra viewers,” clearly past podcasts. There are podcasts distributed broadly throughout all different platforms in addition to ours, whether or not that’s Apple or Spotify or YouTube. And we’ll distribute that and signify these advertisements there. But additionally, for advertisers, we will offer you options on broadcast, SiriusXM. It’s a comparatively small portion of our advert income, however there are numerous prosperous clients listening on SiriusXM or Pandora, in fact, which is basically the biggest piece of the puzzle as we speak for us, the place we will serve advertisements throughout the Pandora platform with much more first-party information and focused advertisements.

So Pandora, to you, represents the direct competitors with the platforms of Spotify and YouTube. You’ve received first-party information, listeners logged in, who they’re, the place they’re, in all probability, and you’ll serve advertisements instantly.

Is that rising? Are you investing in Pandora to make it develop into a real competitor to Spotify and the remaining?

Pandora was form of late to the sport on interactive, so we’ve a pleasant variety of subscribers, about 6 million. By way of completely different tiers, we’ve radio service with out advertisements, Pandora Plus, after which we’ve a small tier, which is totally interactive or on demand. However I imagine the longer term for Pandora is basically within the free tier. And we nonetheless have, if not the biggest, one of many high two largest free music streaming companies within the US. And we’ve numerous sturdy advert expertise and, once more,  the advert gross sales group promoting throughout that platform. I believe, from a shopper standpoint, we’ve a chance to proceed to enhance the listener expertise, however in our sequencing of what we’re constructing… We are able to transfer Pandora to this new streaming platform, too, however that’s in all probability later subsequent yr as a result of we’ve numerous thrilling issues approaching the SiriusXM facet between from time to time.

Do you assume the typical shopper ought to know that SiriusXM and Pandora are the identical firm? Ought to they know concerning the connection there? As a result of, proper now, they appear very completely different.

Not as we speak, and I don’t assume the typical shopper does know that as we speak. We’ve been in a position to carry the capabilities that Pandora presents to SiriusXM, which has been actually necessary, whether or not it’s algorithmic programming or efficiency media or extra digital CRM-type advertising capabilities that we simply didn’t have at Sirius. A part of that’s as a result of Pandora’s had all this information for a very long time, and at Sirius, we actually haven’t had that a lot information on listening as a result of, with the in-car, this satellite tv for pc supply mechanism, there’s no return path of knowledge.

So I don’t know what you’re listening to in your 2016 automotive, however now, with 360L and, more and more, our in-car clients streaming our service outdoors of the automotive and our streaming-only clients, we’ve received this actually wholesome dataset. So we’ve been in a position to leverage numerous the capabilities from Pandora to assist SiriusXM. After which, there’s been different ways in which we’ve introduced the manufacturers collectively in several cases. We have now the Pandora Now station on SiriusXM, we’ve SiriusXM content material every so often pop up on Pandora. So we’ve been in a position to carry content material forwards and backwards. However actually, I believe the most important profit has been on the capabilities.

I’m listening to 1st Wave, ’80s on 8, and Lithium. It’s a direct line. After which, each every now and then, I take heed to TikTok Radio, which makes me really feel like 1,000,000 years previous.

That’s an awesome set of channels. You should have seven or so as a result of that’s what the typical listener has, seven channels.

One thing like that. You’ve tons of of channels, however you’re saying the typical listener has seven. Pandora widens you out, proper? You simply begin and off it goes.

Six million subscribers, advert supported. I take heed to different streaming firm CEOs, they usually say, “Look, the longer term might be some mixture of subscription and advertisements collectively.” Netflix is a subscription. They’ve added an advertisements tier. They appear to be doing fairly properly with it. Disney’s headed that means. Is it the identical in audio? Is it going to be the identical combo the place you pay a charge however you get some advertisements alongside the best way?

Sure, I believe so. I do imagine, although, that SiriusXM, given the premium nature of what we’re offering, we gained’t have numerous advertisements within the service. We do have advertisements on our nonmusic content material, however as we stay up for the pliability that the brand new platform will present us on, say, the commerce facet, we will create much more packages. An ad-supported package deal is perhaps compelling, particularly to our core segments who perhaps don’t wish to pay $19 a month for our core service. So we’ve the chance to create extra ad-supported channels, we will put advertisements within the music channels, and I believe we’ll have a chance to check that once we launch what we’re calling our quick service later this yr. It’ll begin rolling out in 360L automobiles, and we will do extra IP focused advertisements by means of that as properly. And that’ll give us numerous flexibility to simply check out completely different fashions with what content material is on the market. Possibly it’s a free tier, perhaps it’s only a lower-price tier, and regulate the advert load, as an illustration, or the content material that’s out there.

So we talked quite a bit concerning the form of overheated podcast enterprise, the massive acquisitions, the flashy spending. You probably did need to have layoffs earlier this yr, about 7 or 8 p.c of your workforce. It looks like numerous that was within the podcast a part of the enterprise. Stroll us by means of what occurred there and the way you made that call.

We got here into this yr understanding that each auto gross sales and advert gross sales have been going to proceed to be tender for some time period. We’re a public firm, we’re delivering worth to our shareholders as properly, and we’re very centered on ensuring that we had self-discipline round our spending and we checked out each side of the fee construction. We did numerous work final yr to not have to deal with the individuals facet, and we got here into this yr with a very considerate strategic strategy to not solely scale back prices but in addition to have a look at the enterprise and be sure that we may very well be simpler and environment friendly. That meant some reorganization, not likely at my management group stage, however at groups under my leaders to carry issues like analytics groups collectively on advertising or content material groups collectively on the content material facet of the group.

It positively didn’t have an effect on podcasting greater than another group. It was fairly evenly unfold all through the group, and my important focus, having not likely carried out considered one of these for the reason that merger, was that we handled individuals pretty and respectfully and that we ended up in a spot the place the staff which are nonetheless with us really feel very linked with what we’re doing and have a set of obligations that they’re enthusiastic about.

Do you assume you’ll’ve needed to reduce much less in the event you hadn’t splashed as closely on the podcast acquisitions or the podcast spending?

No, I believe the offers we’ve carried out in podcasting actually set us up properly for the longer term. In something, you’re going to have to speculate up entrance. I’m actually excited concerning the monetization alternatives which are beginning to play out and the place we’re going to be sooner or later.

The factor that pursuits me about Pandora proper now’s that it’s in the course of cutting-edge copyright lawsuits, and I’m an previous copyright lawyer, in order that’s captured my consideration. Numerous comedians are suing Pandora saying that they’re owed two units of royalty funds, each for the efficiency of their comedy and the underlying publishing rights to the written model of the comedy. There’s not numerous precedent for that. You may see how, within the present market of mental property, everyone seems to be searching for the subsequent fee as a result of charges have simply fallen so low with digital distribution. The place are you on that? Are you going to return to a decision, or are you going to go all the best way to a trial?

I can’t touch upon the standing of the litigation, however I’ll inform you Pandora’s been an awesome platform, supportive of comedians for a lot of, a few years. And with the comedians whose works we licensed from the labels, in lots of instances, we all the time thought we’ve had the entire proper, whether or not it’s recording or the writing of the underlying jokes. As this litigation began, we did see some comedians depart the group which are collaborating alongside the plaintiff as a result of we needed to take down their works till it’s resolved. So we’ve had some comedians break free from that in an effort to get their content material again up on our platform. However I actually imagine in comedy; it’s been one of many greatest drivers of listening outdoors of music on Pandora and is definitely core to our SiriusXM service as properly. So we are going to proceed to work by means of it and hopefully come to a decision.

You run one of the vital fascinating content material companies on the market since you are so regulated when it comes to rights and funds that you just ship out to individuals. Satellite tv for pc radio licensing charges are written into federal regulation. We’re sort of staring down the abyss of copyright regulation with generative AI and having the ability to pretend voices and names and likenesses and pretend Drake. Are you simply ready for the bomb to go off? Are you actively collaborating in conversations about what the longer term charge buildings needs to be?

Our core music licenses on the SiriusXM facet of the enterprise are licensed by means of the US Copyright Royalty Board. We have now a longtime charge in place by means of… I imagine it’s the tip of 2027, and we’re paying on the musical works that we play, and we aren’t actually concerned within the era of music. So whereas I believe AI might be very optimistic when it comes to its impression on our enterprise, there should not actually the identical points that we’d see in different platforms.

You’ve TikTok Radio. AI Drake explodes on TikTok. Would TikTok Radio play the pretend Drake track?

I don’t know. I assume we haven’t actually crossed that bridge but, however we’ve all the time been alongside the artists on this, and I believe we’ve had a very sturdy place in breaking new artists and constructing their careers and do wish to proceed to be sure that we’re doing that.

The TikTok Radio piece of the puzzle is definitely actually fascinating to me as a result of there’s a lot content material on TikTok the place it’s only a creator or somebody like Charlie Puth simply screwing round, and there’s no related label to go negotiate with. There’s no infrastructure of licensing that content material and ensuring funds truly attain the creators. However numerous it truly does find yourself on TikTok Radio. Do you will have a group that’s similar to, “We’re going to go work out the right way to license these items?”

I imply, TikTok Radio is mostly a curated expertise. So we’re highlighting the content material that has change into fashionable on TikTok, so we’ve the chance to resolve what’s on the channel and what’s not, proper?

However I hear remixes on there that, if I have been a programmer, I couldn’t inform you even the place to start to go get the rights to a preferred track that’s had a remix and has now been sped up by a 3rd particular person. That simply looks like a puzzle of rights administration that one way or the other finally ends up on the radio.

All of our content material is licensed both by means of the US CRB on the recording facet or with direct offers we’ve with the publishers, largely by means of the collectives, proper? ASCAP, BMI, and so forth. So these musical works could be licensed by means of these offers that we’ve in place already.

Let’s speak about automobiles. I’ve been superb at not speaking about automobiles this complete time. That’s all I wish to do. I believe you will have essentially the most distinctive perspective on the automotive business. The best way I give it some thought, you’ve been making software program for automobiles as the one third-party app vendor for 20 years. You purchase a Ford in 2004. There’s no app platform in there, however Sirius’ code and {hardware} is in there. We’re present process a large shift within the automotive enterprise. Sirius’ enterprise is basically uncovered to the automotive enterprise. You’ve talked about it a number of instances. The very first thing I observed is that the business is promoting fewer, dearer automobiles. The development all of the automotive makers appear to be on is as a substitute of numerous $50,000 pickup vehicles, they’re going to promote fewer $100,000 pickup vehicles. That’s the place they’re going. That simply reduces the variety of automobiles you’ll be able to activate Sirius in. Is that one thing you’re anxious about?

“Each time anyone buys a brand new automotive, it’s one other alternative for us to get a brand new subscriber”

The automotive market is definitely our greatest funnel. We’re in simply over 80 p.c of latest automotive gross sales and simply over 50 p.c of used automotive gross sales. So each time anyone buys a brand new automotive, it’s one other alternative for us to get a brand new subscriber, or we’ve present subscribers buying and selling their automobiles or including a automotive to the storage. It’s actually impactful on our enterprise, and we’ve seen subscriber additions gradual on account of that due to the previous few years. We’re beginning to see provide points alleviate, among the provide has grown, significantly for the home manufacturers. That’s going to proceed. And within the automotive business, there have been these cycles up to now the place everybody likes to say, “Properly, the margins are actually excessive. Possibly the business will pull again on stock ranges.” However on the finish of the day, it’s fairly aggressive, they usually desire a share. So I anticipate that, over time, so long as the demand is there and provide begins to return again, gross sales will in the end rise as a result of the automakers wish to go after that incremental sale.

Automobile firm CEOs love to look on Decoder. I like having them. There’s an enormous shift in how we understand of automobiles. They’re changing into way more built-in computing gadgets, particularly with the shift to EVs. One of many causes they’re enthusiastic about that’s as a result of they’re Apple’s margins within the App Retailer and saying, “I need 30 p.c of each transaction that occurs on this display screen, too.” You’re proper within the middle of that, proper? You’re saying, “Put my {hardware} in your automobiles. Right here’s a subscription charge to a really premium service.” Up till now, it doesn’t seem to be there’s been a giant income share happening there, however I can think about each automotive maker goes to say, “Why would I work with you after I can go signal a brand new sort of cope with Spotify and get a p.c of their reduce?”

There may be numerous income. From day one, we’ve shared within the subscription income with our companions, and I believe not solely does that differentiate between us and different media companies as a result of we’ve the margins to have the ability to assist that, but it surely additionally helps us interact with the OEMs to be sure that we’ve the identical incentives, that the service is prominently displayed on the display screen, that we’re getting info on the shoppers so we will market, sending that junk mail that you just get, or emailing clients, ensuring that the trial’s truly on, and it’s very straightforward to get into the service after you’ve purchased the automotive. You’ve numerous different issues in your thoughts once you purchase a brand new automotive, so we wish to ensure that the service is on and dealing once you step into that new automobile and also you get to expertise all of the content material. So the income share has been key to that when it comes to working carefully with the OEMs on what the longer term is for SiriusXM.

Do you assume that income share goes to offer a moat towards competitors? You mentioned you had excessive margins since you’re the one premium providing in a automotive. There actually wasn’t one other one. Now, you’ve received individuals like me with their telephones on their dashboard working Apple Music. You’ve received CarPlay and Android Auto that exposes that instantly within the interface. Is competitors from telephones bringing down your margins within the automotive?

No, it’s not bringing down the margin. In the end, we’re agnostic about what distribution we use. So we are going to all the time have an built-in radio expertise within the automotive with the receiver, and ideally going ahead, our greatest platform is 360L when it comes to offering the very best expertise for the patron as a result of satellite tv for pc supply permits for uninterrupted supply of our service throughout the US. In fact, with modems, there are all the time going to be dropouts in much less closely networked areas of the nation, whether or not city or much less dense areas. So that could be a actual profit to satellite tv for pc supply. However with the IP supply, we will truly customise the service in ways in which all the opposite media companies can do.

So yeah, the infotainment methods within the automotive have been evolving for years, and we’ve actually been on the forefront of that, ensuring that we’re designing for these new infotainment methods, working carefully with the OEMs but in addition, in some instances, working carefully with, say, Google, who’s launching Android Automotive, the working system within the automobiles. That’s going to provide us much more flexibility, too, as a result of we will replace our service quarterly or so similar to each different media app, but in addition we’ll be represented in a number of locations in that display screen as properly.

So, that is considered one of my favourite methods of fascinated about value. You’ve received two buttons on a display screen, and also you push one button, name it Nilay’s Music Service so that you’re not speaking about your rivals instantly. However Nilay’s Music Service is an IP-based streaming service. You would possibly say it seems quite a bit like Spotify. And I push that button, and I’m simply buying and selling on all the cellular broadband infrastructure that exists. And I’d even be buying and selling on a shopper’s personal broadband subscription so I don’t even have to fret about that, and that prices 10 bucks a month.

I push the Sirius icon on that very same display screen, one other interface opens, and now, I’ve received your satellites within the air, I’ve received customized {hardware} within the automotive, I’ve received a 360L system within the background working. That’s all simply dearer.

However all that’s occurring to me as the patron is I’m clicking a button and listening to music. How are you going to compete towards the totally digital platforms which are buying and selling on different individuals’s connectivity?

So dearer within the sense that we’ve launched satellites and we’ve received this infrastructure? As a result of that’s already in place. 

Properly, simply the price of SiriusXM is greater than the price of Spotify.

Yeah. In order we develop this new… our next-generation SiriusXM platform, we’re attempting to unravel for just a few completely different key ache factors, which goes to permit us to broaden the universe of our potential subscribers. And people are value, management, and discovery. That’s what we hear time and time once more.

So the expertise itself goes to ensure, as a result of it’s so important, whether or not you’re listening to our service by means of the cellular app, by means of CarPlay or Android Auto, otherwise you’re leveraging an embedded streaming model, or an embedded satellite tv for pc plus streaming and 360L that, in the end, we have to present extra management and discovery to the patron.

As a result of, up to now, it had been all about broadcast and simply flip the dial to seek out new channels, and that’s not what many youthful customers definitely wish to do.

So, offering these extra enhanced suggestions goes to be key to that. We have now a lot nice content material, but it surely’s very onerous to get customers into content material in the event that they don’t know what we’ve.

After which, offering hyperlinks from that embedded radio expertise and the automotive out to the streaming apps in order that discovery can occur there, which can be a greater place to facilitate it.

After which these behaviors, these listening behaviors, can come again into the automotive. As customers expertise completely different channels or completely different content material outdoors of the automotive will carry these experiences and behaviors again into the automotive.

Ford goes to go from right here to there with their software program stack. They’re purported to be transferring to Android. Who is aware of? They preserve launching automobiles with out it. I must get Jim Farley again on the present and ask him about it. GM simply redesigned their interface to say, “We don’t need CarPlay and Android Auto anymore, and our new EVs going ahead gained’t even have it.” Tesla exists. My new Jeep that has 360L runs a forked model of Android that’s primarily based on Alexa and TomTom maps for some completely bonkers motive. That’s numerous software program floor to cowl. That’s numerous platforms to assist.

One extraordinarily common theme on the present is that when you begin investing in software program, the prices simply escalate and by no means come again down. How are you fascinated about that — supporting 95 completely different automotive makers and their bizarro platform concepts?

That’s the place one thing like AAOS [Android Automotive operating system] is available in, which I imagine about 70 p.c of OEMs have mentioned that they will undertake. We’ll see. That helps us streamline the event course of as a result of it’s mainly one app, and we will distribute it throughout all these gamers.

However that truly hasn’t come true but. Ford introduced that they have been transferring to Android nearly 18 months in the past, and the brand new Mustang is out, and it nonetheless runs QNX with Unreal on high of it. They’re nonetheless this and saying, “The large platform corporations are sitting on high of us.”

Final yr, nearly precisely a yr in the past now at Apple WWDC, they introduced a model of CarPlay that may take over all of the screens in your automotive.

Do you see that occuring? Do you hear that rumble within the business — that the automotive makers as soon as thought they might surrender the automotive interface to Apple and Google, and they’re truly realizing that it’s not the best alternative?

I believe the automakers don’t wish to surrender management, so that they’re looking for the areas the place the Large Tech corporations can help them, however in the end, they will nonetheless management the person interface and attempt to take part extra within the companies enterprise.

So we’ve to be actually versatile, and we actually have been for 20 years, as a result of we’ve needed to design for these completely different automotive UIs since inception, and it was extra {hardware} and fewer software program, and over time, it’s shifted to much more software program.

We’ve already had the infrastructure, the group, the sources in place to have the ability to design throughout a number of varieties of implementation. I’d say we in all probability had much less management over what that regarded like than we are going to going ahead so long as the OEMs are likely to coalesce round just a few completely different options, however we’re going to have much more flexibility it doesn’t matter what, particularly as we design for these new options which are coming ahead.

Right here’s an especially loaded query. Do you employ CarPlay in your automotive?

I do, yeah, however I transfer forwards and backwards between the SiriusXM radio, after which I’m utilizing CarPlay for my navigation.

I don’t even use CarPlay in my automotive. I simply mount my cellphone on the dashboard, which my Vergecast listeners know. They assume it’s the dumbest factor on the earth, and I ought to simply use CarPlay.

However that shift the place I’d relatively have two screens together with your interface on one display screen and a map on the opposite — no automotive does this properly. Are you pleased with how your software program is being expressed within the automotive, and do you assume the automotive makers are going to provide the instruments to get to the place you ought to be?

Partly, it comes again to 2 issues: income share, which definitely motivates, and shopper demand. So one of many greatest complaints we hear very often from customers who’ve quite a lot of these startup EVs — excessive finish, new introductions to the market on the EV facet the place we aren’t current as we speak, although we simply launched a beta model in Lucid — is that SiriusXM isn’t there, and it’s not straightforward to make use of essentially.

“We have now numerous prosperous clients who simply come into their new automobile purchases and anticipate us to exist there”

I believe that works in our favor, particularly as a result of, once more, we’ve numerous prosperous clients who simply come into their new automobile purchases and anticipate us to exist there. So I do imagine that’s going to be a pressure to assist us navigate this with the OEMs to make sure that our presence on the display screen could be very apparent and that clients can get proper into the service simply.

You talked about you didn’t have numerous management over your person interface earlier than. That is sensible for 1,000,000 causes. Now, we’re simply placing full-on tablets in the course of automobiles, for higher or worse. These are app platforms. You may design the app nevertheless you need. Is your imaginative and prescient that the app on a cellphone, the app on a automotive, the app on an iPad ought to all look and work the identical?

There ought to definitely be continuity, however we’ve designed for these in-car experiences for a very long time, and we perceive the safety and security pointers by means of NHTSA for in-car implementation, so I believe it’ll naturally be completely different within the automotive. We are able to do much more within the apps when it comes to permitting for management and discovery, however we would like the continuity throughout the platform. What we’re constructing now will permit for that, whether or not you’re listening by means of the apps or within the automotive or in some methods by means of linked gadgets within the dwelling as properly.

The place do you assume the endpoint of this massive shift to automobiles as computer systems is? Is it, “Lastly, we’re going to eliminate the steering wheel and self-driving occurs and everybody simply is in a world of screens fortunately purchasing of their automobiles,” or is there a special sort of endpoint?

We’re definitely speaking a methods out into the longer term, proper? It’s actually fascinating as a result of, I’d say, 10 years in the past, everybody was speaking about autonomous, and it was the most important subject for the automotive business, and also you don’t actually hear as a lot about it anymore. It’s all about electrical, and we’ve received our arms full, I believe, as a rustic and an business and simply rolling out electrical automobiles.

I’m biased. I’m at an audio firm, however I do imagine that intimate listening expertise to audio in a automotive, one thing that we do phenomenally properly, persons are simply enthusiastic about it — whether or not it’s 1st Wave or Richard Blade otherwise you’re passionate concerning the host and the curation that exists on our service, that audio listening expertise, even when the steering wheel goes away, goes to proceed for a protracted, very long time.

That is the risk, although. I used to be asking about it properly, and also you have been speaking about it instantly, which is: you’re taking out the steering wheel and now everyone seems to be watching YouTube on their telephones. Do you see that as an existential risk? Do you need to market towards that?

Actually not as we speak, and I’d say it’s going to be much more like 20 years into the longer term, and even then, it’s a small quantity of automobiles popping out, and I do assume, at some stage, it flies within the face of what customers really need. There are numerous customers on the market that need the driving expertise, and once more, it’s been all of those years, we’ve all been educated as customers on audio within the automotive, and it’s a really particular linked expertise to be listening to, whether or not it’s your music, your favourite channel, or your favourite discuss host.

It may very well be Howard or Andy Cohen or Megyn Kelly. We have now such nice expertise on our platform that I believe these connections and that behavior could be very properly established. It’s going to take quite a bit to disrupt that.

The place do you assume the mixture of podcasting and broadcast comes collectively? As a result of what we’ve talked about for the reason that begin of this dialog is: on the finish of the day, the patron sort of doesn’t perceive the distinction between the distribution, however your corporation positively does, proper? What you are promoting is aware of, “With the satellites within the automobiles, there’s a whole well-built, profitable enterprise mannequin with excessive margins.” After which, over right here on podcasting, we’re nonetheless inventing advert monitoring tech and advertising expertise, and that’s a wide-open area.

If self-driving is 20 years away, you’re not anxious about that — the convergence of these issues looks like tomorrow, proper? We’re truly asking individuals to pay some huge cash for a {hardware} streaming system when the automobiles have Stage 2 driving, and you’ll perhaps screw together with your cellphone a little bit bit extra. That’s going to get an increasing number of squeeze. Are you fascinated about that?

We’re fascinated about it in how we’re designing this platform as a result of it comes again to, once more, addressing these gaps we’ve round management and discovery, however essentially, we’re a curated audio expertise. I believe what our clients love most about us is that we do assist information you thru the content material you’ll love, and we’ve a set of music channels that our customers love. We have now a set of discuss audio content material that our subscribers love. Which may be within the type of podcasts or simply on demand. It may very well be reside reveals which are tailored to on-demand and present up as a podcast.

So I believe so long as we’re offering that guided expertise and providing customers a extra curated expertise to allow them to assist discover the content material that they love, that’s the place we offer numerous added worth versus numerous different platforms, the place you’re simply doing essentially much more work to seek out issues that you just love.

All proper, Jennifer, this has been nice. Thanks a lot for giving me on a regular basis. Thanks for indulging the automotive discuss. Really, I might have carried out the total hour on simply what’s going to occur to the automotive.

We are able to come again and try this.

You mentioned there’s a brand new app coming. Give us the timeline. What’s subsequent for Sirius?

We’re actually enthusiastic about this next-generation expertise. It begins with a launch later this yr within the fourth quarter with a set of latest streaming apps, but in addition step one in re-architecting every little thing, all of the foundational capabilities — actually addressing each shopper touchpoint with higher commerce, identification, MarTech information capabilities. That foundational expertise will enhance relevance, ease of use, and worth for our subscribers and potential trialers and actually go towards addressing these ache factors that we’ve talked about, whether or not it’s flexibility on value or extra management and discovery. And it’s going to assist improve the streaming expertise — in the event you’re a streaming-only subscriber or in the event you’re an in-car subscriber, whether or not you’re leveraging satellite tv for pc solely or 360L, it’ll assist together with your listening behaviors outdoors of the automotive, that are delivered by streaming or the streaming infrastructure that helps 360L. And simply, once more, enhancing worth for our subscribers by offering simpler navigation of our service and extra discovery of all the nice content material we’ve.

I believe it positions us rather well for the longer term. We have now a very sturdy basis financially but in addition a really loyal, happy set of subscribers that we will construct off of as we launch this subsequent expertise.

Wonderful. Trying ahead to that. When the app launches, you’re going to have to return again and inform us all about it.

Can’t wait. Thanks, Nilay.

Decoder with Nilay Patel /

A podcast about massive concepts and different issues.

SUBSCRIBE NOW!

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .